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Computer Forums > PC Technology Zone > Linux, BSD, other *nixes & Open Source Software » correct me if im wrong, i think of linux as...
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Old 08-16-2006, 07:17 AM   #1 (permalink)
 
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Default correct me if im wrong, i think of linux as...

I think of linux like the black hole in space...

An empty vacuum that is to ur exposale.

My main question may really be simple, i just need you guys to confirm it.

Linux starts of as an empty box that you fill up with stand alone programs....right?

I want to know....what are the minimal programs needed, to get linux installed....with absolutly nothing else.

Sort of like windows.....the minimal programs needed to get it up and running.

Are alot of them small programs needed? Or can you listr them here?

The base files.....

I know u need a few....like

hardware detector...
mmm...i cant think any more....is it possible to list them?

Or are they to many?
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Old 08-16-2006, 07:58 AM   #2 (permalink)
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I can't really answer your question, not sure if anyone else can as well because I am not sure why you would need to know this. What are you trying to do? A linux distro can be a very small text based system or a full loaded desktop version. Some very good and still very small distro's are Damm small linux and feather, And they still have GUI's (graphical user interface) and you would be surpriced at how much functuallity they actually have. I recomend you try feather just because if you like it a few click's and you can install it to your hdd. You could also try DSL N (damm small linux :NOT) it also has a hdd install. But for a true desktop system ubuntu or open suse is the way to go IMO.
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Old 08-16-2006, 10:39 AM   #3 (permalink)
 
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Kernel > filesystem > a GUI/cli..

Rest is up to you, I'd personally go download slackware but meh.
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Old 08-16-2006, 11:37 AM   #4 (permalink)
 
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Quote:
Originally posted by A-mak
Kernel > filesystem > a GUI/cli..

Rest is up to you, I'd personally go download slackware but meh.
kernel with a toolchain, filesystem, and shell

it can be as little as a couple of megabytes
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Old 08-16-2006, 01:21 PM   #5 (permalink)
 
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Yes, reply no. 1 and 2 are getting what im trying to say.

Im really tring to understand what is the basis of linux.

Minimal needs just to get a DOS like thing up.

-kernel
-shell
-HDD detector

and so on...so i guess you guys are telling me it is very small. Can be small as a floppy. Thats good to know...that answer another question abt hardware upgrades...

rather than buying a high end system to run on windows...

You can start out your own server....from scratch with only what you need installed.

The base system

kernel

etc....minimal things needed to get it up.

then we can add the extras

file server
web server
firewall
utilities so on.
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Old 08-16-2006, 01:35 PM   #6 (permalink)
 
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The kernel handles HDD detection. I would agree with horndude 100%.
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Old 08-16-2006, 07:59 PM   #7 (permalink)
 
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well to compare DOS to linux, dos has its own kernel which also uses a few separate apps which run concurrently to handle hardware and provide a layer for the dos shell which you as a user see

Linux uses a kernel as well, but part of linux is also that being combined with the GNU software which is the linux or desktop unix implementation of the unix standard tools or software----these get compiled together and form whats called a toolchain. Linux is mostly written in C, with some assembler and machine language in parts of the kernel. This toolchain allows you to either replicate more linux installs or software and also allows you to build upon that base system to form what many think of as linux. In reality the definition of linux is just the kernel and the GNU software, the rest is extra.

Now here's the part where it gets a little confusing. When you build a linux distro or system you can choose everything and anything about the system. You literally can roll your own so to speak. But in order to do this you really need an existing linux system to do it, the first ones were not easily setup, bootstrapping a linux system aint easy. You do need the kernel and a small handful of the GNU software to form a linux system, and thats how you get it down to floppy size. You simply use a bootloader like LILO or GRUB, a kernel, and just enough of the GNU software like BASH(bourne again shell) or better yet a standalone program which emulates BASH and voila, you have a very very basic linux system.

To see a good example of this, go here:
http://distro.ibiblio.org/pub/linux/...ions/baslinux/

Can you build a very small server setup using linux that fits in a few megabytes, sure, absolutely. With some sacrifices of course, there's no free lunch.

If you want a list of the GNU software you will need, goto http://slackware.com and then goto packages and look up the /a directory, that has all the usual required software which makes up the base user/system software. You will alos need a kernel, a bootloader, a filesystem to mount all this on and run it from. Probably need to get some of the networking software from the /n directory as well. This same stuff can be gotten from the gnu.org website as well. You can avoid getting the rest of the toolchain, things like gcc and the c library if you use precompiled apps with static libraries instead of dynamic ones. This is the way baslinux is formed, it also makes use of an app that emulates the BASH shell, takes up less disk space that way.

Now, you can to a large degree use quite a few standalone apps that have been compiled with static libraries, but the normal way to do this is use shared libraries, once you start doing that things get more complicated and bigger. but its also necessary to provide more functionality and options. Most linux distros make large use of dynamic libraries. The apps themselves are usually small, the libraries can get pretty big. The C library isnt lightweight at all these days, its quite big.
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Old 08-16-2006, 09:14 PM   #8 (permalink)
 
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Dave,

Strange Question, basicly the deal is if you want a basic Linux no fuss no frills then you will have to download the smaller versions of it such as basic Linux like suggested above.

Most distros come in a package whereby MOST of the system is already there and you add a few bits and peices if you so desire. you can compile Distros from souce if you so wish with somthing like Gentoo: http://www.gentoo.org/ which leaves it up to you to install everything

A base Linux system comprises of nothing more thann a Kernel, terminal, shell, Word processing and a web browser, with Little else.

a good example of a system like this is DSL, it has a strpped Kernal word processing and internet.
http://www.damnsmalllinux.org/

if you want to research some strpped distros then this would be a good place to start:
http://www.linuxlinks.com/Distributions/Floppy/

More strppied Distros include:

feather Linux
http://featherlinux.berlios.de/

Vector Linux
http://www.vectorlinux.com/

Puppy Linux
http://www.puppylinux.org/user/viewpage.php?page_id=3

Slackware
http://www.slackware.com/

BeatrIX
http://www.watsky.net/

feather Linux
http://featherlinux.berlios.de/

Vector Linux
http://www.vectorlinux.com/

DSL
http://www.damnsmalllinux.org/

Puppy Linux
http://www.puppylinux.org/user/viewpage.php?page_id=3

Slackware
http://www.slackware.com/

BeatrIX
http://www.watsky.net/

you can find more here
http://www.linuxlinks.com/Distributi...Distributions/

hope this Helps,

Jake
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